Alcoholism Support Group

When I first started AA I had to start from scratch on what I unterstood God to be. The of my youth that Martin Luther understood was a very harsh God (or so I percieved at the time)that would condemn mr to hell for not being repentant and changing my addictive ways.

So, I just understood God to be that diety that created me and the rest of the universe. No, judgement, no damnation, just God. As that God expressed himself in the group conscience of AA, I came to khow that I had to seek His will for me and my life.

This, I thought, was another obstacle because God really never spoke directly to me and I really waited for the epiphany that others speak of where they feel God's presence and direction. Without the shock and awe experience that I wished for an immense depression set in on my sobriety. Finally, I picked up the Big Book again and the answer was there when it wasn't the first time I read it. It spoke of God doing for me what I couldn't do for myself.

So, back to the well of my youth, I picked up Luther's Small Catechism and read it for the first time in 30 years. God's will for me was there in black and white. I read scripture just about everyday now. While the depression comes and goes still, the message of God's will for me and the promise of my eternal salvation is now the spiritual foundation of my sobriety.

The concept of the Higher Power is there to get folks back to a primary basis point with thier creator in order to begin to grow spiritually again (or for the first time).

Although, I have observed that folks that don't chose to call God thier higher power seem to struggle more in the program. Just an observation for what it is worth.

AAs don't make themself beleive in anything.

They become open to a Higher Power.

Become open minded to the idea that there is a Higher Power...

Do the Steps...

God will reveal himself to you!

Personally, I've always identified with the artist in Steinberg's portrayal of this age-old dilemma:

http://www.cartoonbank.com/assets/...

MikeInthe …

I can't imagine who you're talking to.

One important understanding as a result of gaining sanity, sobriety, maturity, painful, joyful admissions, all the human qualities given to man; The fact that humans can think and react as they want and justify anything, rationalize all kinds of sick cultural, political, de-humanizing and killing actions what-so-ever to justify their religious beliefs, to me, that is a travesty to all humans.

Why does it have to be religion that brings the human equation into balance? Who manipulated that? Why all the killing and the outright turning of ones back to oppression and other outrageous behaviors of man to this planet and again, why use shame to convince the populus to conform? How can anyone who has faith, kill another human being in the name of their God?
Why don't they use the Old Testament and try to explain the contridictions in practices? What's with all those stories that justified incest of family in order to procreate the human race? Why are so many laws in todays world of understanding and in different countries and cultures concerned with only their priorities and influences by specific individuals who play God and dictate laws and religious doctrine? In our own country the politcal machine with all of the lobbying powers of religious organizations have and will continue to manipulate the legislatures, the courts and the Executive powers of our country through monies and votes to those who would enforce specific moral and idealistic agendas, once again controlled by the pocket book of these so called God faring individuals. I could go on and on.

As for my Higher Power, it has nothing to do with all the aforementioned items. I simply wish to treat others the way that AA has so simply taught me to live. To live and treat others in respect, understanding, every possible feeling humanly possible that I can practice FIRST to others and come to realize through time get back as a result of having simple, not over thought, contrived, manipulated and fear driven nonsense of the mind, pure human understanding. This planet is part of that as well. Why do I have to have a belief in religion to be a loving and caring human being, I DON"T.

Keeping it extremely simple, I have an HP in my life and I'm not it!

BIGBEARSHEART,

Ummmmmmm I didn't mean for this to turn into a religious or anti-religious thread.

I simply wanted to know how a HP helps people in AA when it's the example I gave.

I could argue every point you attempted to make but I won't bother.

I will say this, there have been more people killed in wars that
were not religious wars, in fact many were atheist leaders.

Adolf Hitler --six million Jews in the Holocaust, three million Poles, three million Russian prisoners of war, and as many as eight million others throughout Europe.

Joseph Stalin --10 and 20 million Soviets and German prisoners of war died under his regime, depending on how many famine victims you count, from Gulags, execution, and forced resettlement.

Mao Zedong -- tens of millions of Chinese, most of them in public executions and violent clashes.

Pol Pot -- 2 million Cambodians, or as much as 20% of the population, died from execution, disease and starvation.

BIGBEARSHEART,

I meant to ask, who or what is your higher power then?

Can we stick to my original question please?

NODP2DAY,

I think maybe it's best if this thread be closed. I can see where it may be heading because some people are so militant in their anti-religious beliefs.

Seems my simple question angers some people. I just wanted to finally attempt to understand this HP idea.

Abeliever, If you read the last paragraph you'd see that I made notice that due to the aforementioned examples, why I described my Hp in my life that has been doing fine for the last 18 years.

If I offended you that was not my intention nor my point of opinion.

I haven't read all the threads, and I'm not even in AA. That being said, I understand the question and I've often asked it myself. Since I began communicating with other alcoholics, I found something kind of amazing.....those that have experienced real recovery...people who are balanced, compassionate, and humble....all of them seem to have a similar concept of God, regardless of who they think God might be. Maybe God reveals himself to people who are seeking spiritual truth? And maybe it's a long process, but it happens with time.

I didn't used to think this way - it was "my way or the highway".